I just got off the phone with Green Tree. The account manager there told me that the account is past due by 185 days and if a payment is not made within the next 7 days the account will be charged off and wage garnishment will start! After I told him that he has no right to threaten, particularly that a court order will be required to garnish wages, he backed off a little.  He suggested that a payment is made, and if so, the 3rd phase negotiator will be assigned to the process immediately.  Is he bluffing? He read an excerpt from the Acceleration Clause about the right of the lender to pursue foreclosure.  I recognized it and told him that it is from the Acceleration clause, standard verbiage! He agreed and still insisted that if the payment is not made, legal action will resume immediately.  Any thoughts? Should I ask the seller to make the payment or just wait and see?  I will keep the seller informed, I do not know what to suggest.

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Replies to This Discussion

Mark...I had the same response from my GT negotiator. In fact, she stated if not paid, it would be written off and seller unable to complete a short sale. I found that hard to believe when in the past in cases of written off balances, I was successful in getting a lien release and closing my short sale, although that was a different lender. Additionally, she stated if he did not make a payment, there was nothing she could do for my seller. She would not complete her review nor request a BPO. And lastly, she is absolutely adamant that GT receive 5% of purchase price. I don't intend to back off in pursuit of this short sale but clearly, this negotiator isn't going to help my seller unless instructed to do so by her manager or supervisor. I will update later with results.
Thanks for the information, Tammy. He ended up sending me a fax with required documents and a couple of letters regarding Notice of Default and Right to Cure Default. Nothing stating when the charge-off date is or the amount. Bluffing? May be. Remains to be seen.
Green Tree is the most shameful company I have dealt with yet. Their employees behave just like those trained in a big collection agency with their mantra of standard threats acting like thugs delivering the message. Whatever you advise your clients, check your State laws, make sure it is a full release and not a partial and do not pay GT a nickel off the HUD1. You have to protect yourself and your Sellers from any type of mortgage fraud and protect your Sellers from GT chasing them down for any $$$'s after the closing.
Thanks for your input Susan. In your short sales with Green Tree, what were your end results? Did they take less than 5% of purchase price? Did they make any concessions?

Mark....my client also received a Notice of Default and ability to cure. Please keep us posted on your Green Tree ss progress.

Susan Sandoz said:
Green Tree is the most shameful company I have dealt with yet. Their employees behave just like those trained in a big collection agency with their mantra of standard threats acting like thugs delivering the message. Whatever you advise your clients, check your State laws, make sure it is a full release and not a partial and do not pay GT a nickel off the HUD1. You have to protect yourself and your Sellers from any type of mortgage fraud and protect your Sellers from GT chasing them down for any $$$'s after the closing.
Hi Tammy, Unfortunately, GT at that time wanted 15% of the outstanding 2nd and only a partial release (2nd was near $100,000). The 1st would not give them more than $2,500, GT would not accept, they would not release period. It was an FHA and in the FHA Pre-Foreclosure program so all the 1st could allow/give them was $2,500 on the HUD1. No party to the transaction was able or willing to pay them anything off the HUD1 which they were asking. Home in foreclosure forced there by GT as the 1st had agreed to SS and was ready to close. :(

Tammy Shuyler said:
Mark...I had the same response from my GT negotiator. In fact, she stated if not paid, it would be written off and seller unable to complete a short sale. I found that hard to believe when in the past in cases of written off balances, I was successful in getting a lien release and closing my short sale, although that was a different lender. Additionally, she stated if he did not make a payment, there was nothing she could do for my seller. She would not complete her review nor request a BPO. And lastly, she is absolutely adamant that GT receive 5% of purchase price. I don't intend to back off in pursuit of this short sale but clearly, this negotiator isn't going to help my seller unless instructed to do so by her manager or supervisor. I will update later with results.
Mark - I've worked with Green Tree and I think they might be bluffing! Be persistent.
call it a bluff or a lie, bottom line Greentree is EXCELLENT at what they get paid to do....get as much money as possible for the Investor on the note......


They tell you one thing b/c MOST of the time you will cower and do as your told - -give up your commission, do EVERYTHING you can to get them 10% or 15% of the amount owed, etc......they do this b/c it works.

Understand the game, understand the process, and you will kick _______ at short sales.

For Greentree, circumvent them, find out who the Investor is on the note, and, contact them with logic and facts:

"Accept the short sale and lose $xxxx, or, take the home to foreclosure and run the risk of teh Seller TRSASHING the property and lose more than $xxxx"

What also works, if you are serious about attacking them back, contact the state attorney general, OCC, and OTC with your complaints....it works.
Ben, I like your idea about contacting your State regulator.... strict credit regs... could scare them!

Ben Benita said:
call it a bluff or a lie, bottom line Greentree is EXCELLENT at what they get paid to do....get as much money as possible for the Investor on the note......


They tell you one thing b/c MOST of the time you will cower and do as your told - -give up your commission, do EVERYTHING you can to get them 10% or 15% of the amount owed, etc......they do this b/c it works.

Understand the game, understand the process, and you will kick _______ at short sales.

For Greentree, circumvent them, find out who the Investor is on the note, and, contact them with logic and facts:

"Accept the short sale and lose $xxxx, or, take the home to foreclosure and run the risk of teh Seller TRSASHING the property and lose more than $xxxx"

What also works, if you are serious about attacking them back, contact the state attorney general, OCC, and OTC with your complaints....it works.
Thank you, Wendy and Ben. I will keep posting here until the file closes.
I have just spoke with a manager at GT. He states it is BofA, the investor, that is steadfast regarding the 5% minimum contribution in my ss. I pointed out to him my 1st with Chase who is servicing for Fannie Mae, will not allow seller contribution and in fact FM just handed down a new guideline reducing amount of contribution from 3% to 2% of sales price to 2nd. He said BofA doesn't care...they want their full % at closing...no promissory note will work either. He said in his 2 yrs of working with bofA loans, they have never taken any less and they get done all the time I asked how and he will research for me. However, I am looking for others out there who could elaborate how they completed their 2nd GT/BofA ss and what they did to make sure GT got their minimum 5%. If you prefer to email me, please contact me tammyshuyler@gmail.com. Thanks!
Spoke to the account manager yesterday after submitting the complete package. He went over the documents, congratulated me for having the complete file and said: I am going to walk to the loss mitigation department and deliver your file. However, we will not go far if a $200 payment is not made; the account is due to be charged off in 2 days.

Called him back today, explained the hardship the seller is going through. No difference, the payment has to be made today to move forward with the short sale. "I am looking at the borrower's credit: if there is the great hardship you are talking about, how come their car payment is current, and another couple of accounts that are current? We will charge off the account and start to collect what is owed" He went on to say that they do not want to be an obstacle to the short sale, but after being delinquent for over a certain period, the investor demands the account to be charged off. Once the account is charged off, the recovery department will not be able to do anything for 6 months - no short sale.

Is this true? I do not know. Is this a tactic to collect? Most likely. Do I want to put my client in this situation? Definitely not. I have explained the situation to the client and will have them make a decision. I have disclosed everything I knew.
Susan Sandoz RE/MAX 303.771.9400. Will visit if you would like.

Mark Saakian said:
Spoke to the account manager yesterday after submitting the complete package. He went over the documents, congratulated me for having the complete file and said: I am going to walk to the loss mitigation department and deliver your file. However, we will not go far if a $200 payment is not made; the account is due to be charged off in 2 days.

Called him back today, explained the hardship the seller is going through. No difference, the payment has to be made today to move forward with the short sale. "I am looking at the borrower's credit: if there is the great hardship you are talking about, how come their car payment is current, and another couple of accounts that are current? We will charge off the account and start to collect what is owed" He went on to say that they do not want to be an obstacle to the short sale, but after being delinquent for over a certain period, the investor demands the account to be charged off. Once the account is charged off, the recovery department will not be able to do anything for 6 months - no short sale.

Is this true? I do not know. Is this a tactic to collect? Most likely. Do I want to put my client in this situation? Definitely not. I have explained the situation to the client and will have them make a decision. I have disclosed everything I knew.

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