Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Pamela Walsh on September 15, 2011 at 8:52am

I'm not an attorney; just have a son that is one. :>)  However in the state of Idaho, if a party has a judgment recorded against them, it becomes a lien on any real property in that person’s name.  In essence it becomes a lien on the home you are working on. The title company cannot insure clear title until the lien is released.  The short sale lender has no control over this situation.  We have been successful numerous times in getting the party to the judgment to do a partial release specific to that legal description and thus the short sale to close.  The judgment is still in effect against the person and any other properties.

Permalink Reply by Shelleen Wienke on September 15, 2011 at 9:22am

Thank you Pamela. I wondered if that was the case as I am originally from Idaho myself. However, the attorney I spoke with said that in Missouri, where I live and practice real estate, the Missouri Judgment Lien Statute, Section 511.350. states

 "Judgments and decrees rendered by the associate divisions of the circuit courts shall not be liens on the real estate of the person against whom they are rendered until such judgments or decrees are filed with the clerk of the circuit court pursuant to sections 517.141 and 517.151."

In otherwords, the judgment must be filed with the circuit court in order to be a lien. This judgment was not filed with the circuit court only with the associate court making it a small claim and not a lien against the property. Getting the short sale negotiator or better yet the underwriters to understand Missouri law is the hurdle I am up against. The independant title company they used must not be out of Missouri because this did not show up as a lien with our title company and I asked them to update it a few days ago.

Permalink Reply by Pamela Walsh on September 15, 2011 at 10:07am

It does sounds like since it was in small claims court there in Missouri, you have the basis for no lien and clear title.  If you present the statues and explanation to the bank, they should get your transaction closed.  You may have to escalate to a much higher authority that can actually understand the law! The foreclosure division will have an attorney that can understand and interpret you state law.  Good luck!

Permalink Reply by joe beauchamp on September 15, 2011 at 5:21pm

You have a lousy negotiator - I hear they are overrunning WF these days.  Liens are none of the bank's business.  They are the servicer for the loan.  The investor should have no interest in the liens - what the investor wants is the maximum cash for the property.  They have no right to care about the property or seller or his grandmother once they have their money and their obligation of any sort is gone.  This is NO business of the negotiator's - if you have a half decent investor (that means not "we don't care, we suck the life out of taxpayers" FNMA), you should make the case of how good your deal is and that the negotiator at WF is trying to kill the deal and get them less money.

It is of interest to the title company at closing about liens, but NO business of this bank - none.  The title company is responsible for any actions against a clear title, not this bank.  Your negotiator is way out of line.  I'm guessing that you need to go as high as possible and explain lawsuits, damaging homeowner's future with false claims.

Let me 'splain it this way - the buyer/seller have the absolute right to close on the property w/o clearing the lien - the title co will make an exception to coverage for the lien and it will move with the property to the new owner.  Perfectly legal acceptable and I did a lot of this as "subject to" for years.  In any freakin' way, is this the business of WF?  This is as capricious as WF saying that they are the sellers and not the homeowners - not in the U.S. - at least not yet.

Being a good deal, I find it just as outrageous that WF is ripping off the investor as they are damaging the seller.  Is this jerk doing this just to keep the account longer as it goes to foreclosure and into their REO dept while they are paid by the investor to "manage" the account?  Escalate until you get someone who can count to 10 and understand what you are saying.  I don't know WF these days but I have to believe that some of these reasonable people are still there.

Good luck..

Permalink Reply by Brent Innocenzi on September 22, 2011 at 3:21am

Obviously there is no point in dealing with your current negotiator further. You need to escalate the file and hit the hot points - cash buyer, offer above appraisal/FMV, less of a NET loss with this short sale as opposed to foreclosure, and that the title is clear. A quick paragraph email hitting these points with the file in the proper hands you will be able to move forward towards approval/closing. Escalating works!

Permalink Reply by Shelleen Wienke on September 26, 2011 at 1:50pm

Brett and Joe, You are both right and that is exactly what I did. I sent them a copy of the judgement explaining that it wasn't really a lien, a letter from the lawyer explaining Missouri law and I contacted the upper management at Wells Fargo both through Twitter and from contact information I found on here. I got it accelerated and today I got the final approval. This cash deal will close on Weds. Persistance is key to winning the short sale battle. Thank you all for your help and beware that they are now caring about NON- existant liens. CRAZY! 

Permalink Reply by Kevin - Greenville, SC on September 27, 2011 at 6:32am

Maybe these will assist.

Attachments:

• No lien affidavit.pdf, 39 KB
• Statement of information.pdf, 33 KB

Permalink Reply by Shelleen Wienke on September 27, 2011 at 7:03am

Hey these are great Kevin. I am saving them in my arsenal.