Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Louise Dela Cruz on August 17, 2011 at 8:53am

I had the same experience. The people negotiating the offer @ AMS (on behalf of BofA), insisted on the HAFA price with no movement at all.

Finally the buyers wanted the home so much they gave in after several weeks, asked for no credits and offered full price.

I had previously uploaded the approval from the second in the library.

BofA came back and said they were closing the file as the 2nd lender (to whom they sold the 2nd in the midst of negotiating) was not a participant!! I argued of course they were as they approved the sale and referred them to the uploaded document, to no avail.

They did everything they could to NOT participate in HAFA. This is extremely sad as my seller not only qualified she was an elderly widow who could have definitely benefited from the credit. She has opted to refuse HAFA and  move forward with a traditional short sale.

Permalink Reply by Sameer Punjani on August 17, 2011 at 10:39am

Tammy

 

Nothing is regulated.  The FDIC gave BOFA and other banks sweetheart deals to cover 80-95% of their losses through a program called the loss share agreement.  The banks have given millions of dollars to lobby no changes in the current environment. They have no incentives to do any type of short sales.  All the government can do is talk in the media, but unable to take any action.  Banks pay off the government a few million in fines and move on.  

 

Google a term, "loss share agreement"  and it will expose the truth the banks don't want you to know.

Permalink Reply by Tammy Evans on August 18, 2011 at 4:02am

Louise, you are the second person I have talked to where the lendor has sold the note in the middle of negotiations. That is unfortunate your elderly client was treated that way, I am sure she didn't need that. Hopefully all worked out well in the end.

Louise Dela Cruz said:

I had the same experience. The people negotiating the offer @ AMS (on behalf of BofA), insisted on the HAFA price with no movement at all.

Finally the buyers wanted the home so much they gave in after several weeks, asked for no credits and offered full price.

I had previously uploaded the approval from the second in the library.

BofA came back and said they were closing the file as the 2nd lender (to whom they sold the 2nd in the midst of negotiating) was not a participant!! I argued of course they were as they approved the sale and referred them to the uploaded document, to no avail.

They did everything they could to NOT participate in HAFA. This is extremely sad as my seller not only qualified she was an elderly widow who could have definitely benefited from the credit. She has opted to refuse HAFA and  move forward with a traditional short sale.

Permalink Reply by joe beauchamp on August 18, 2011 at 5:52am

BOA has usually been bad to work "with".  Since the release of Equator software in mid-March, they have been truly absolutely horrible to get anything done properly or at all.  I see people in the office breezing by with HAFA at other banks while I see one absurd wall after another pop up with BOA HAFA.  Really really bad.

For instance, the process of receiving the BPO, calculating the NPV, asking for the bank's own payoff, hitting the calculate button and countering had been averaging 3 or 4 days with a regular short sale at BOA.  I've had this process take months w/HAFA.  One took long enough that they had to do another BPO.

For AMS, etc., all the work is done by BOA.  AMS sends a request for a BPO to BOA.  When that is done, AMS sends a request for a negotiator at BOA to calculate the NPV.  When that is done AMS sends a request to BOA to get the BOA payoff.  When that is done AMS sends a request to BOA to hit the calculate button.  When that is done, AMS gives you the number/counter.  You have no access to whoever is at BOA not doing this job.  Can BOA possibly screw this up this bad and not do so on purpose?  Could you?  Could a 1st grader?  Hmmm.

So, think through how BOA operaties - they point fingers - their SS reps do not know that BOA is actually doing these operations and will tell you to talk to LRC or AMS, etc. when you have a problem.  7/1, BOA told UTLS to kill any new HAFA FNMA short sales.  They didn't tell their SS reps who kept assigning them to UTLS.  I had 2 stuck there.  When I have power of attorney, I don't have a problem telling the BOA SS rep to obey me for the HAFA info.  I cannot get UTLS, LRC or AMS to do so because they have specific orders from BOA to ignore the legal POA.  Do they behave illegally or do they want BOA to terminate their contract? 

When you see how they work, you can figure out what to expect.  BOA seems to impose harsher terms on their HAFA sub-companies (and use them as scapegoats all the time).  So, do you think that BOA just might have said, "no lower than the BPO"?  Do you think AMS would dare look at reasonable info and adjust to a better deal?  I don't.

BOA's HAFA is very drawn out by BOA under the hood.  BOA appears to be using these HAFA companies simply to say that they are doing everything they can to help the country and do what the fed's want.  Since they don't even tell their SS reps that BOA negotiators are really doing the "work" (yes, the HAFA underwriting is done by a BOA negotiator, too), it sure looks like these companies are fully set up to take the fall if/when there is outcry to the poor performance of BOA's HAFA "work".  So, the 4 day process from BPO to counter at BOA which is engineered and managed to take 2 to 3 months via AMS, that is AMS' fault - fire 'em!  You don't like the numbers coming from that bad old AMS?  Fire 'em - wasn't us at BOA - it was them.

My limited experience has been that HAFA at BOA is very stiff.  And, as BOA has become almost impossible, HAFA at BOA has become worse.  I have never felt any flexibility through the HAFA sub-companies, and it makes sense.  Those negotiators are temporary help - there may be leeway for negotiators at BOA - they are employees, but at AMS?  They had better come in with super deals or none at all.

Permalink Reply by Sameer Punjani on August 18, 2011 at 5:55am

Like i said ams sucks. Google my blogs i was one of the first agents to expose them. Google ams servicing sucks and add a comment.

Permalink Reply by Jeff Payne on August 18, 2011 at 7:02am

Sameer, that is a urban legend that to my knowledge no one has been able to substantiate.  I understand what a loss share agreement is but have not actually seen the loss share agreement between BofA and FDIC.

The other one was Indy Mac/Onewest Bank. FDIC loss share agreement and that one was also found to be false as it was posted online from FDIC and Onewest Bank sometime back

Sameer Punjani said:

Tammy

 

Nothing is regulated.  The FDIC gave BOFA and other banks sweetheart deals to cover 80-95% of their losses through a program called the loss share agreement.  The banks have given millions of dollars to lobby no changes in the current environment. They have no incentives to do any type of short sales.  All the government can do is talk in the media, but unable to take any action.  Banks pay off the government a few million in fines and move on.  

 

Google a term, "loss share agreement"  and it will expose the truth the banks don't want you to know.

Permalink Reply by Jeff Payne on August 18, 2011 at 7:05am

because this is within the 20% range BofA will usually accept

I am always curious where these numbers come from? 20% is a pretty big number, especially when it looks like you are talking about GROSS numbers and not NET numbers.  Big difference.  NET numbers would more likely be 30% after expenses. 

 Would you really fight over 2% and not just make the offer that HAFA had already approved so that you can get the house that you want?

How much is the approved sales price?

Permalink Reply by Jeff Payne on August 18, 2011 at 7:08am

I certainly don't disagree with you there.  There is no need for a 3rd party like this to even be involved with these sales, and since they are being utilized, there needs to be someone that is able to check on them and hold them accountable.

Sameer Punjani said:

Like i said ams sucks. Google my blogs i was one of the first agents to expose them. Google ams servicing sucks and add a comment.

Permalink Reply by Jeff Payne on August 18, 2011 at 7:11am

My last BofA/ HAFA sale, took 70 days from contract submission to close, I believe we had approval in 40 days and took 30 days to close.  It was thru equator and there were 2 BofA mortgages on it.  I have not had the (dis)pleasure of working with one of their companies like AMS.

joe beauchamp said:

BOA has usually been bad to work "with".  Since the release of Equator software in mid-March, they have been truly absolutely horrible to get anything done properly or at all.  I see people in the office breezing by with HAFA at other banks while I see one absurd wall after another pop up with BOA HAFA.  Really really bad.

For instance, the process of receiving the BPO, calculating the NPV, asking for the bank's own payoff, hitting the calculate button and countering had been averaging 3 or 4 days with a regular short sale at BOA.  I've had this process take months w/HAFA.  One took long enough that they had to do another BPO.

For AMS, etc., all the work is done by BOA.  AMS sends a request for a BPO to BOA.  When that is done, AMS sends a request for a negotiator at BOA to calculate the NPV.  When that is done AMS sends a request to BOA to get the BOA payoff.  When that is done AMS sends a request to BOA to hit the calculate button.  When that is done, AMS gives you the number/counter.  You have no access to whoever is at BOA not doing this job.  Can BOA possibly screw this up this bad and not do so on purpose?  Could you?  Could a 1st grader?  Hmmm.

So, think through how BOA operaties - they point fingers - their SS reps do not know that BOA is actually doing these operations and will tell you to talk to LRC or AMS, etc. when you have a problem.  7/1, BOA told UTLS to kill any new HAFA FNMA short sales.  They didn't tell their SS reps who kept assigning them to UTLS.  I had 2 stuck there.  When I have power of attorney, I don't have a problem telling the BOA SS rep to obey me for the HAFA info.  I cannot get UTLS, LRC or AMS to do so because they have specific orders from BOA to ignore the legal POA.  Do they behave illegally or do they want BOA to terminate their contract? 

When you see how they work, you can figure out what to expect.  BOA seems to impose harsher terms on their HAFA sub-companies (and use them as scapegoats all the time).  So, do you think that BOA just might have said, "no lower than the BPO"?  Do you think AMS would dare look at reasonable info and adjust to a better deal?  I don't.

BOA's HAFA is very drawn out by BOA under the hood.  BOA appears to be using these HAFA companies simply to say that they are doing everything they can to help the country and do what the fed's want.  Since they don't even tell their SS reps that BOA negotiators are really doing the "work" (yes, the HAFA underwriting is done by a BOA negotiator, too), it sure looks like these companies are fully set up to take the fall if/when there is outcry to the poor performance of BOA's HAFA "work".  So, the 4 day process from BPO to counter at BOA which is engineered and managed to take 2 to 3 months via AMS, that is AMS' fault - fire 'em!  You don't like the numbers coming from that bad old AMS?  Fire 'em - wasn't us at BOA - it was them.

My limited experience has been that HAFA at BOA is very stiff.  And, as BOA has become almost impossible, HAFA at BOA has become worse.  I have never felt any flexibility through the HAFA sub-companies, and it makes sense.  Those negotiators are temporary help - there may be leeway for negotiators at BOA - they are employees, but at AMS?  They had better come in with super deals or none at all.

Permalink Reply by Tammy Evans on August 18, 2011 at 9:41am

The listing agent put it on the market before HAFA accepted. My offer was full list price with 3% on top to cover closing as was appropriate in looking at comparables in the area. The sellers accept the offer, excluded the range, range hood, and refrigerator at the same time HAFA approved the price. I received the seller’s disclosures and there are some repairs that need to also be done to the home. I instructed the agent to go ahead and submit as is, due to the needed repairs and the exclusions; bear in mind, this is my first HAFA and I have had no problems in the past w/ Bank of America accepting an offer such as this for similar reasons; after reading all of these posts and doing a little research I am not to certain anymore. I am considering having the listing agent rescind the valuation request or should I just move forward with the valuation request and wait 90-days for a response.or does it make any difference at this point? Doesn't sound so streamlined anymore.

 

Jeff Payne said:

because this is within the 20% range BofA will usually accept

I am always curious where these numbers come from? 20% is a pretty big number, especially when it looks like you are talking about GROSS numbers and not NET numbers.  Big difference.  NET numbers would more likely be 30% after expenses. 

 Would you really fight over 2% and not just make the offer that HAFA had already approved so that you can get the house that you want?

How much is the approved sales price?

Permalink Reply by Jeff Payne on August 18, 2011 at 9:49am

HAFA is definately not a streamlined process for sure.  So how far apart are you right now from what BofA is asking for?  Are you the buyer or the buyers agent?

Tammy Evans said:

The listing agent put it on the market before HAFA accepted. My offer was full list price with 3% on top to cover closing as was appropriate in looking at comparables in the area. The sellers accept the offer, excluded the range, range hood, and refrigerator at the same time HAFA approved the price. I received the seller’s disclosures and there are some repairs that need to also be done to the home. I instructed the agent to go ahead and submit as is, due to the needed repairs and the exclusions; bear in mind, this is my first HAFA and I have had no problems in the past w/ Bank of America accepting an offer such as this for similar reasons; after reading all of these posts and doing a little research I am not to certain anymore. I am considering having the listing agent rescind the valuation request or should I just move forward with the valuation request and wait 90-days for a response.or does it make any difference at this point? Doesn't sound so streamlined anymore.

 

Jeff Payne said:

because this is within the 20% range BofA will usually accept

I am always curious where these numbers come from? 20% is a pretty big number, especially when it looks like you are talking about GROSS numbers and not NET numbers.  Big difference.  NET numbers would more likely be 30% after expenses. 

 Would you really fight over 2% and not just make the offer that HAFA had already approved so that you can get the house that you want?

How much is the approved sales price?

Permalink Reply by Tammy Evans on August 18, 2011 at 10:07am

$5,600.00; I am an agent.

Jeff Payne said:

HAFA is definately not a streamlined process for sure.  So how far apart are you right now from what BofA is asking for?  Are you the buyer or the buyers agent?

Tammy Evans said:

The listing agent put it on the market before HAFA accepted. My offer was full list price with 3% on top to cover closing as was appropriate in looking at comparables in the area. The sellers accept the offer, excluded the range, range hood, and refrigerator at the same time HAFA approved the price. I received the seller’s disclosures and there are some repairs that need to also be done to the home. I instructed the agent to go ahead and submit as is, due to the needed repairs and the exclusions; bear in mind, this is my first HAFA and I have had no problems in the past w/ Bank of America accepting an offer such as this for similar reasons; after reading all of these posts and doing a little research I am not to certain anymore. I am considering having the listing agent rescind the valuation request or should I just move forward with the valuation request and wait 90-days for a response.or does it make any difference at this point? Doesn't sound so streamlined anymore.

 

Jeff Payne said:

because this is within the 20% range BofA will usually accept

I am always curious where these numbers come from? 20% is a pretty big number, especially when it looks like you are talking about GROSS numbers and not NET numbers.  Big difference.  NET numbers would more likely be 30% after expenses. 

 Would you really fight over 2% and not just make the offer that HAFA had already approved so that you can get the house that you want?

How much is the approved sales price?

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