Short sale DENIED with No Counter

So here goes.long story short. Three years ago now I have stopped making payments after we found fraud and another member of our group file for bankruptcy on a 1M house that was done as an investment/second home property  (we were going to use it for a few years and then sell it)..

We have brought a short sale to the table (now PNC was NCB) offer two times which was approved by the first then denied by the second.  Now the third time the second approved but the first denied with no counters.  We added an additional 30K to the offer and again the first denied with NO COUNTER.  We have a lawyer involved and we just threatened the bank, and finally the foreclosure lawyer said that "he wants no part of a legal battle."  That was almost 2 weeks ago and still nothing.  So now I just got a 4th offer with more money and again we will add an additional 30K.  Right now I'm not going to go through the crap of getting all our financials together again and doing this when they won't even come to the table.  We have some real discrepencies in our loan that was uncovered through both a loan auditor and a retro appraiser. lots of behind the scenes legal stuff.  So far our legal fees are about 15K and we haven't even gone after the bank yet.  At this point we don't have another option since this investor won't even come to the table. 

 

HELP PLEASE. We are not some rich folk, it's a long story as to how we got here. But here we are now and I desperately need out of this.   We have done everything to show good faith. the house is in mint condition, well cared for, HOA fee's paid, insurance, if it breaks we fix it...

 

I could go on and on but there it is in a nutshell.

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Permalink Reply by Sam on September 12, 2011 at 3:25pm
Have you discussed bankruptcy as an option with bankruptcy attorney? Has your sister, or your husband?

Your description of their financial situation does not describe someone who is eligible to file...be careful threatening what you cannot follow through on, the banks are not uneducated when it comes to the "b" word, it is categorically ignored by the loss mitigation departments as they hear that from everyone...and they know that it is not the cut and dry to file.
Permalink Reply by Sharon Smith on September 12, 2011 at 3:43pm
Put it this way my husband and I could easily file for bankruptcy. All my sister has is her job, nothing else. And since we live in PA  they can't take our salaries or our houses or our 401K's--other than that we have nothing else.
Permalink Reply by Joshua Gayman on September 12, 2011 at 3:54pm
Sharon, you have a case for short sale, if your agent/negotiator knows what they are doing. But, I don't know about trying to take them to court, these banks pay a lot of money for attorneys and can tie the whole thing up in court for a very long time. I would never recommend ACTUALLY filing for bankruptcy and going through with it unless it was your last option, but then again I am not a Bankrupcy attorney.
Permalink Reply by Sharon Smith on September 12, 2011 at 4:01pm

Josh,

I thank you. GOD knows we don't want to file for bankruptcy and we are hoping that our 40 page document will get the attention of the bank to at least come to the table. I would just love to get a short sale done no matter even if it's half the loan that would be better than nothing.  I can tell you we do understand the banks angle. Why the hell would they care about us. 

But alas here we are now and at this point I want my life back.  I don't live in anything fancy we just get by with three kids. What do they want from us 100.00 a month for the rest of our lives? Cause I don't see how they could get much more!     Anyway, now that we told them too much (knowing our financials) what should we do now?    I wish you were in Florida to help us out!

 

Permalink Reply by Joshua Gayman on September 12, 2011 at 4:05pm
Sharon, I can help you out, I have partners in Florida. Message me so that we can get in contact. I sent you a friend request.
Permalink Reply by Sam on September 12, 2011 at 4:00pm
Perhaps your sisters and brothers financial situation is not that strong, your previous post made me believe it was. It is not always the case on this type of file, and PNC is certainly a pain in the rear, but I would lean towards lack of focused effort on behalf of the person/agent/attorney that is presenting the offers. There are certainly "black hole files" that we all encounter where you cannot get response (that have nothing to do with seller hardship) but if your negotiator is persistent enough, this can be eventually overcome.

Keep trying (perhaps with different negotiator)...you also have to be persistant and not give up. If you have not already, I would have the real conversation with your bankruptcy attorney regarding your ability to file, and this goes for your sister as well. You need to know with certainty what your options are and bankruptcy laws can be very complex.
Permalink Reply by Joshua Gayman on September 12, 2011 at 4:03pm
Well said Sam, I agree here 100%
Permalink Reply by Sharon Smith on September 12, 2011 at 4:17pm

Sam,

It seems like you have a lot of experience in Short Sales and since I'm a total dummy in this area (engineer) could you please provide me with some direction.  and no I'm not just throwing the B word out there. We have honestly looked into it.  There is more background here than what meets the eye. Though my husband has a decent job, we are still far away from being "upper class".

 

Permalink Reply by Sharon Smith on September 12, 2011 at 4:22pm

sorry Sam didn't see your post until after I typed my above.... this site is slow....

 

And now I just received a phone call from my relator that our buyers just backed out after waiting 10 months.  Now I want to cry. 

 

Permalink Reply by Sam on September 12, 2011 at 4:32pm
Don't worry about the buyer...they are a dime a dozen. You need to get someone in the drivers seat that can get the bank to the table, there will always be a buyer for a short sale with a bank willing to play ball. Sounds like Josh has someone that is in that market who is on the ball, maybe worth looking into.

Educate yourself so you know your legal options, make sure your negotiator/agent/atorney has a proven track record, stay persistent, be realistic in your expectations and you will eventually get this worked out.
Permalink Reply by Sharon Smith on September 12, 2011 at 4:50pm

Yes but that is the part we haven't been able to find, a freakin driver!  Would you say my lawyer isn't doing their job or is it my relator or who? 

Also do you think that I can do this myself?  I haven't been able to rely on anyone so far.  Gosh knows I'm a smart cookie that can take on a sales role very easily....I think I will just call the customer service line and find out who my investor is and try that angle in the morning.  what the hell it can't hurt. Any other ideas?

Permalink Reply by Cameron Novak on September 12, 2011 at 7:07pm

I just have to say that it's AMAZING how many agents spout off about being SS experts and having "contacts"... just to find out those agents have only closed a handful of short sales in the past year, and none with the bank with which they claim to have connections.

 

Signed,

Not Surprised

 

P.S.  Why are all of you giving advice to a person who currently has an agency relationship?  I'd say you're lucky to be flying under the radar right now.  (No offense Sharon, but similar to a client/attorney relationship, agents are not supposed to cross the line of acting as an agent to a party they don't legally represent).

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