Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Lori Young on July 14, 2010 at 7:36am

Wow that is rude of them to even ask. I would call Wells Fargo CEO office and make a complaint. That is BS about the 4% for Wells seconds. I have closed many files and never reduced on a Wells file. Who is the investor for the file? Did you ask for the manager of your rep and did they put this in writing? Push your way to the top with this one.

Permalink Reply by Victoria Frieberg on July 14, 2010 at 7:41am

are you dual agent? Although they cannot demand..I had another bank, not wells, look at my commssion as a dual agent..and hint. I had already assumed it would go into the pot..1st approved 6%, a 'assumed' 4% would be agreed at..and ended up contributing that amount to get the deal done. Would not have done it if it was not dual, and liveable. On the other hand, an argument would be that you may have to pay taxes on this commission at the full rate, so why should you. The negotiator may accept that argument

I am still not clear with my accountant on if I am going to bite that extra payout in taxes..the hud shows full commission, but a 'contribution' from the selling agent of x amount...

Permalink Reply by Sherrilee Denton on July 14, 2010 at 7:44am

Not a dual agent. Listing agent only. Buyers agent to get 2.5% leaving me with 1.5%, after split with broker and business partner, taxes, etc. I would walk away with less than $400 which does not even begin to cover expenses of marketing, signage, etc. I would be in the red

Victoria Frieberg said:

are you dual agent? Although they cannot demand..I had another bank, not wells, look at my commssion as a dual agent..and hint. I had already assumed it would go into the pot..1st approved 6%, a 'assumed' 4% would be agreed at..and ended up contributing that amount to get the deal done. Would not have done it if it was not dual, and liveable. On the other hand, an argument would be that you may have to pay taxes on this commission at the full rate, so why should you. The negotiator may accept that argument
I am still not clear with my accountant on if I am going to bite that extra payout in taxes..the hud shows full commission, but a 'contribution' from the selling agent of x amount...

Permalink Reply by Ben Benita on July 14, 2010 at 7:46am

First - -don't hate the negotiator, they are hourly persons trained to read BS like that to you from the scripts they are given (remember, they are called "negotiators" for a reason).

Try these lines first:
1 - “Let me check with my broker to see if we can agree to that” – again, puts you in the “same boat” as your negotiator, middle-person checking with a “boss”. Call them back the next day and tell them your Broker will not allow you to reduce your commission, and, ask the negotiator "What do you think we should do"
or
2 – “If I can get the Buyer to increase his/her sales price by 1% or 2%, so that the investor on this receives the same
NET, can we get the 6% agreed to in the signed sales contract and listing agreement”
or
3 – “I spoke to my broker and he said we can NOT agree to reduce the commission on this. If this buyer walks, will you at least keep the file open so we can find a new buyer, one who will cover your shortage?”

I would start with those, then ESCALATE your file ASAP!!!! I would also STRONGLY suggest you find out who the investor is on the note and speak directly with them.

Again, never any real reason you should give up your commission on a short sale....NEGOTIATE, NEGOTIATE, NEGOTIATE!!!!!
I have [email protected]

Permalink Reply by Victoria Frieberg on July 14, 2010 at 7:56am

When I am not dual, I don't negotiate..when I am, it seems in everyones best interest (if the money is there) to keep everyone happy and throw in some. When you have the fiduciary duty to both sides, seems like insurance..to a reasonable degree (of course!)

Permalink Reply by Sherrilee Denton on July 14, 2010 at 8:20am

Thanks Ben, your reply is appreciated :)

1. I already played the broker card. They are not asking me to reduce my commission, BUT to pay them $5,060 or 2% of the proceeds of my commission and contribute it to them. My commission was already reduced by the 1st by 1% which I was willing to do as I was still receiving an acceptable commission.
2. Even if I did get the buyers to increase their purchase price by 1% - 2%, Wells Fargo as the 2nd would never see a dime of it as the1st is already offering them $3K and would not offer them anymore.
3. The agreement letter has been received on the 1st and Wells is agreeable to what the 1st is offering them $3K, but they are countering for 2% commission contribution from my agreed to 6% commission. The buyers agent will receive 2.5% of that.
4. Wells keeps referring to their "lender guidelines of no more than 4% commission" and because the agreement letter from the 1st approves 6% they are wanting me to contribute to them 2%. That is a crazy demand & is never going to happen. My commission is coming from the 1st and Wells is getting their $3K. If they don't concede, this will foreclose and they will get nothing. How is that an appropriate lender guideline to walk away and get nothing?

Ben Benita said:

First - -don't hate the negotiator, they are hourly persons trained to read BS like that to you from the scripts they are given (remember, they are called "negotiators" for a reason).
Try these lines first: 1 - “Let me check with my broker to see if we can agree to that” – again, puts you in the “same boat” as your negotiator, middle-person checking with a “boss”. Call them back the next day and tell them your Broker will not allow you to reduce your commission, and, ask the negotiator "What do you think we should do" or
2 – “If I can get the Buyer to increase his/her sales price by 1% or 2%, so that the investor on this receives the same
NET, can we get the 6% agreed to in the signed sales contract and listing agreement”
or
3 – “I spoke to my broker and he said we can NOT agree to reduce the commission on this. If this buyer walks, will you at least keep the file open so we can find a new buyer, one who will cover your shortage?”

I would start with those, then ESCALATE your file ASAP!!!! I would also STRONGLY suggest you find out who the investor is on the note and speak directly with them.

Again, never any real reason you should give up your commission on a short sale....NEGOTIATE, NEGOTIATE, NEGOTIATE!!!!!
I have [email protected]

Permalink Reply by Victoria Frieberg on July 14, 2010 at 8:33am

guidelines are guidelines..and I never had the 4% one thrown at me. would they respond to 'who do you expect to pay the income tax on the commission" line?

Permalink Reply by JOSE PENA on July 14, 2010 at 9:09am

Sherrilee,

I hope this helps. You can forward this to Wells Fargo. They should know better than that! As Realtors we work very hard to earn our commission, especially in short sales.

These are some of the most beautiful words in the Fannie Mae Servicing Guide:

"Effective March 1, 2009, closing of preforeclosure sales may not be conditioned upon a reduction of the total commission to be paid to real estate agents to a level below what was negotiated by the listing agent with the borrower, unless the fee exceeds 6 percent of the sales price of the property in aggregate. Servicers are reminded that they must continue to obtain any approvals that may be required by interested third parties in connection with preforeclosure sales. (Part VII Section 504.02)"

you can google a form that has Fannie Mae's letter head and email/fax to Wells Fargo. After that they should stop asking you to "contribute" some of your hard earned commission. Best of luck!

CHEEERS!

Permalink Reply by Sherrilee Denton on July 14, 2010 at 9:14am

Thanks for the reply Jose!

I use this information all the time and in fact already provided it to Wells Fargo.

They respond saying "we are not asking you to reduce your commission, you are getting your commission , but contributing a portion (2%) to us, and it is not a Fannie Mae loan either . . .

Permalink Reply by JOSE PENA on July 14, 2010 at 9:27am

If this is a Freddie Mac loan, the rule still applies :)
but...if it's a conventional then there might be a possibility it applies to that as well (i've been reading information regarding that). Wells Fargo is using different language, but at the end of the day they are still asking you to reduce your commission, it's apparent they are cutting corners from the guide lines.

I would even suggest to be as bold as to forward some of your conversations with wells fargo directly to Freddie Mac or even to NAR. I'm sure you would get a letter from them directed to Wells Fargo that better be cautious of what they ask for. Let wells fargo know that you will take this as far as you need to for a fair transaction. (I've done something similar to that and it helped.)

"contribution" PPPFFFFF! yeah right, anyway wells fargo tries to put it they are still asking for a reduction.

Sherrilee Denton said:

Thanks for the reply Jose!

I use this information all the time and in fact already provided it to Wells Fargo.

They respond saying "we are not asking you to reduce your commission, you are getting your commission , but contributing a portion (2%) to us, and it is not a Fannie Mae loan either . . .

Permalink Reply by JOSE PENA on July 14, 2010 at 9:29am

another idea to record conversations with banks is if you have an iphone or someone you know has one. download the app

"CallRec.Me" it's free and it lets you record conversations and save them for your records.
(it helps a ton!)

best of luck Sherrilee.

Permalink Reply by Sherrilee Denton on July 14, 2010 at 9:38am

Not Fannie or Freddie . . . so Wells can care less about Fannie or Freddie guidelines.
Negot is not answering phone today and her voice mail says its too full .! . .

JOSE PENA said:

If this is a Freddie Mac loan, the rule still applies :)
but...if it's a conventional then there might be a possibility it applies to that as well (i've been reading information regarding that). Wells Fargo is using different language, but at the end of the day they are still asking you to reduce your commission, it's apparent they are cutting corners from the guide lines.

I would even suggest to be as bold as to forward some of your conversations with wells fargo directly to Freddie Mac or even to NAR. I'm sure you would get a letter from them directed to Wells Fargo that better be cautious of what they ask for. Let wells fargo know that you will take this as far as you need to for a fair transaction. (I've done something similar to that and it helped.)

"contribution" PPPFFFFF! yeah right, anyway wells fargo tries to put it they are still asking for a reduction.

Sherrilee Denton said:

Thanks for the reply Jose!

I use this information all the time and in fact already provided it to Wells Fargo.

They respond saying "we are not asking you to reduce your commission, you are getting your commission , but contributing a portion (2%) to us, and it is not a Fannie Mae loan either . . .

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