Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Adela Picar on September 21, 2010 at 6:35pm

Hi Elaine,

I have worked on short sales with PNC with a BK and they try to get as much as they can because they know that they will not be able to go after the seller since they filed a BK. What is the 2nd lien for? I would go to their manager for approval. This also may be a private investor who are always hard to deal with.

Permalink Reply by John Bell on December 20, 2010 at 3:12pm

Elaine, PNC has no recourse, so if you want something then they want something. If the Buyer/Agents  cannot come up with the $30k the deal is dead. the law says they cannot shake down the Seller, that is against the law. In California we are non-judicial state so we have the Seller sign the Prom Notes if they allow and get a sharp attorney to fight the collection and they will win and the bank will have to pay legal fees and court costs. What state are you in?

The lesson: DO NOT TAKE PNC/NATIONAL CITY DEALs 

Permalink Reply by John Bell on February 2, 2011 at 2:02pm

As Adela said PNC knows that there is no recourse Post-BK. PNC might be getting more $$ via Mortgage Ins (if any) or Foreclosure/ Default Ins than if they cooperate with the SS and get "something". I have heard when the 2nds get $0 they qualify for more govt money. Escalating up is always a good idea to see if a Manager steps in. PNC's MO (Modus Operandi) is to get a Non-BK Seller to sign a Prom Note sometimes for the balance. So, had the Seller (Borrower) done the SS first and then do the BK this maybe could have been avoided. Many Sellers are getting bad advise from BK Attorneys. The only way to cure the demand is to meet it. If the Buyer won't or can't then it does not look good. Sorry, I cannot think of a remedy other than filing a Lis Pendens to stop the sale, then do a Forensic Loan Audit , then litigate. All very costly and messy.

Brooke Sigler said:

I am having the exact same issue.  Only in our case, PNC (actually there is an investor) wants $60k.  All of the sellers debts have been discharged in BKand the 1st is owed so much that the will be $0 left for the 2nd if it goes to foreclosure (which is literally days away).  The negotiator has said that more often than not, the investors end up getting what they want, so they basically won't give in.  Since they end up winning most battles, they're willing to let a few go rather than negotiate. 

Permalink Reply by Brigitte Mueller on February 3, 2011 at 10:34am

I have a simular situation....PNC second for $18,000 and the negotiator kept hounding for $5000.   (3 from first, balance from agents) and now the negotiator has changed his mind and wants $6500.   So I had the homeowner call, and find out why they changed the value.   The negotiator told me $6500 and the homeowner was told $6000.   What's up with that?

So we escalate the file, only to find out the negotiator has closed the file.   Simular to your's, there is a BK involved so PNC will get nothing.   So what's wrong with accepting $5000?    That's almost 30% of the full debt, and yet they are willing to get nothing.

I don't understand what PNC is thinking.   Any ideas?

Permalink Reply by Elaine Pappas on February 11, 2011 at 5:44pm

Hi John ~ I'm in CA and the SS did not go through because PNC would accept nothing less than $30k and we ran it through twice.  Lesson learned - if PNC is the 2nd, the seller WILL be required to pay a large amount & most sellers do not want to do that.

John Bell said:

Elaine, PNC has no recourse, so if you want something then they want something. If the Buyer/Agents  cannot come up with the $30k the deal is dead. the law says they cannot shake down the Seller, that is against the law. In California we are non-judicial state so we have the Seller sign the Prom Notes if they allow and get a sharp attorney to fight the collection and they will win and the bank will have to pay legal fees and court costs. What state are you in?

The lesson: DO NOT TAKE PNC/NATIONAL CITY DEALs 

Permalink Reply by Elaine Pappas on February 11, 2011 at 5:53pm

Hi Brigitte ~ PNC is really hard to crack! With my BK seller, PNC would accept nothing less than $30k so it did not come together.  Now I have a buyer where we're waiting for approval's & the sellers 2nd is PNC (not my client) and she just plunked down $14k because PNC 2nd was going to close the file if they didn't get it. They must have better options on the back side unless they get what they want from the seller.

Brigitte Mueller said:

I have a simular situation....PNC second for $18,000 and the negotiator kept hounding for $5000.   (3 from first, balance from agents) and now the negotiator has changed his mind and wants $6500.   So I had the homeowner call, and find out why they changed the value.   The negotiator told me $6500 and the homeowner was told $6000.   What's up with that?

So we escalate the file, only to find out the negotiator has closed the file.   Simular to your's, there is a BK involved so PNC will get nothing.   So what's wrong with accepting $5000?    That's almost 30% of the full debt, and yet they are willing to get nothing.

I don't understand what PNC is thinking.   Any ideas?