Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Thom Colby CA Brkr 888-391-5245 on November 24, 2010 at 9:58am

Hello Brianne,
You shoudl be chatting with your REALTOR who will be the best person to push the Listing Agent. As a Buyer, you have NO control over this process. As some things may seem logical to you (and the rest of us too) it may not b e as cut and dry as we all wish. Most likely, although both loans are "BofA", they are likely NOT owned by BofA and merely serviced by BofA for other investors. It it also likely to be two different investors. There may also be a Mortgage Insurance Company (who insured the loan{s} against loss). The investor may be another bank or it could be one or more pension funds for example, so the approval may take a while. You can be almost certain you will receive a counter-offer from BofA and you will have an opportunity to counter also. The investors are not going to accept a price that is significantly below market value - those days have passed.

Best of luck, talk with your REALTOR and if you really want this house - hang in there.

Cheers,
Thom Colby
Newport Beach, CA

Permalink Reply by Janice Whit on November 26, 2010 at 2:27am

Hi there, I, too, am a hopeful buyer of a short sale and while I don't want to dash your hopes, here's how mine has been going. We also have a first and second with BofA.

We offered on August 13th, submitted to BofA on Aug. 17th, heard nothing until September 21st when they countered our offer (they wanted $3K from us, and the seller to sign a note for $15K), we countered with our original offer on Sept 24th, it went to investor on October 14th (investor is Fannie Mae). October 27th bank comes back and says investor wants the first paid off with nothing going to the second. So back to negotiate with the 2nd (BofA). They come back on November 15th with an approval letter good through December 15th that first will be paid off and 2nd will get $2500. However the acceptance letter states that the bank may go after the seller for the deficiency so ......

Now our freakin sellers are balking! They have not yet signed the acceptance letter or even asked the bank to waive the deficiency. So it has been almost 2 weeks now and still nothing from the sellers. Last I knew they were going to talk to their accountant and their attorney. But still I wait.

It is a very frustrating process, especially when the sellers signed the short sale addendum with the offer that specifically states that they could still be responsible for the deficiency, so they knew it all along. I don't think its fair that now that all parties have finally approved, they can sit on this for weeks trying to decide if they want to still go through with it or not. We have been very patient and the process is very frustrating. I hope you have better sellers than we do!!

Good luck and be patient!!

Permalink Reply by M C on November 27, 2010 at 10:00am

You are right Thom, I just lost a BOfA short sale (possible serviced by BOfA for this investor) one loan. BOfA counter-offer $200,000. They want FMV of $245,000 + $5,000 cash . The selling agent is upset thinks I should pressure BOfA and the investor to take $200,000 or less. We submitted the offer in late Oct. for ($165,000). Received counter offer in early Nov. after BOA received their updated valuation of property. It appears per BOfA the investor not going to accept a price below FMV. Back on the market the property will go!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Permalink Reply by Jim Schneider on November 27, 2010 at 6:23pm

Brianne, when you say there was an appraisal done 11/9, do you mean one done by BofA or an appraisal done for your mortgage? If it's your mortgage you may be moving pre-maturely. Here's a few questions you should ask your Realtor:
1. After checking the mls history for the listing agent, how many short sales has the listing agent closed?
2. What is your (your agent's) estimate of the fair market value of this property?
3. Does the listing agent know which investors hold the mortgages?
4. Does the listing agent know if there is mortgage insurance on either of the seller's loans.
5. Has a foreclosure sale date been set?
6. When was the lis pendens filed on the property (if it has been already)

All of that should be relatively easy to get. If the listing agent does not have #3 or #4 you could have your agent suggest using a Qualified Written Request, see Ben Benitas posts regarding this. With that information we will be able to give you a much better idea of what to expect.

I also hate to break this to you, but a short sale with a first and a second is often going to take six months or more to get worked through, so I'm worried your expectations may be a little off if you are this anxious and it hasn't been two months yet.

Permalink Reply by Brianne Burke on November 28, 2010 at 3:41pm

1. The listing agent is well known in the area for doing short sales...other respectable realtors have said that he will get the job done.
2. Our offer is considered FMV by our realtor and seller realtor w/maybe a small discount, but we are hoping our all-cash offer will help. The house was on market for a few weeks before they eventually accepted our offer because the house did not draw another offer.
3. I am not sure if the listing agent knows who the investors are.
4. Not sure about mortgage insurance either on these loans.
5. A foreclosure sale date has not been set at this time, doesn't even show up on Foreclosure Radar yet as a preforclosure.
6. Not sure about lis perdens either....

The appraisal done on 11/9 was by BofA, not us.

Just wondering estimates for hearing counter (or acceptance) by BofA. This coming? Next week? Longer? Futhermore, once you hear a counter/acceptance, how long can the negotiating process go on for? Once there is an approved offer, does escrow open immediately and is it roughly a 30 day escrow? Shorter because we are all cash? Longer because it is a short sale?

My husband has the relationship with our realtor and due to his very busy schedule, sometimes my questions get lost in translation. :)

Thank you all for posting. I really do appreciate all the input. And if it took 6 months to close, I can accept that, but was also told that many short sales these days are going much more quickly....

Permalink Reply by Jim Schneider on November 29, 2010 at 8:05am

Brianne,

thanks for filling those details. I'm glad to hear the listing agent has some experience in this, that is often the most important factor on whether the short sale gets accepted or not. Usually you're looking at 3-6 months total in a short sale, I'd expect on the longer end since there is a 1st and 2nd mortgage involved. I have seen it take 4-6 weeks from the date the bank sends out the appraisor or bpo agent and when they come back with a counter offer

I would definitely find out when the lis pendens was filed, because that will give you insight into how long before there is a foreclosure/foreclosure sale. Your agent should be able to find that out for you, and give you some estimate of how long it takes from lis pendens to foreclosure in your area.

I would also have your agent ask the listing agent to get 3 and 4. Many times the servicer will give you the information if asked, and it can be obtained with a Qualified Written Request if they won't give it just because the listing agent asks. The seller can most likely look at his last mortgage statement and see if there is mortgage insurance on it.

The reason I stress knowing who the investor is, is that BofA is likely just the servicer. The investors (and MI company if any) ultimately make the decision, so their speed or lack there of is going to control how fast or slow, easy or difficult the process is going to be.

The owners could use:
http://www.fanniemae.com/loanlookup/
or
https://ww3.freddiemac.com/corporate/

often the information can be gained there as well, and it's relatively simple.

Permalink Reply by Jake Bowers on December 3, 2010 at 3:54pm

Brianne,

Per what I have learned from others on this site, you can ask the LA to have the sellers write a QWR (Qualified Written Request; not a big thing to do) to BoA and then BoA has to tell the seller who the investors are. It's a useful thing to know IMO when the rounds of negotiations hopefully do finally occur, so you can know how much to concede and when. And, if the investors are FNMA of FreddieMac, you can learn on this site what their current negotiatiing attitudes and practices are.

BTW, we're buyers in a SS. We signed the purchase contract on June 14th and our 1st counter from BoA just came in today. The LA is not very experienced overall, he has not been willing to push BoA, and we found out a month ago that the seller's attroney was also advsing him to not press on BoA. We have not been able to fathom the attorney's reasoning......(but in this particular area, many things are done behind the scenes....). So there are lot's of reasons for your deal to potentially go SLOOOOOOW for you. Just be prepared......The LA is the key person for you.

My best advice is to spend hours and hours on this site reading threads on the forums for BoA, Equator, Help!, and a few other forums here. You will find some very informative threads here, which, if you follow, will give you some pretty good insight and ideas on what to expect. I feel far, far better prepared to deal with the counter we have received, thanks to a lot of time spent reading here, and a lot of very helpful info from many of the very experienced and sharing person here. This site is a real jewel!

Good luck!

Permalink Reply by Jim Schneider on December 4, 2010 at 4:59am

Jake Bowers said:This site is a real jewel!

Good luck! I couldn't agree more with Jake's statement about this site. I've closed many short sales before I found this site, and I learned many new strategies to make short sales easier and faster, as well as a boat load of contact information for escalations and background on what kinds of deals each investor will likely accept.

Permalink Reply by Bryant Tutas on December 4, 2010 at 8:25am

Great discussion. And I'm happy to hear you are finding this site helpful. Thanks for participating!!