Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Thom Colby CA Brkr 888-391-5245 on August 3, 2011 at 6:35am

Send copies of both SB 931 and SB 458 along with another HUD without the $95,000.  Attached a letter addressed to him confirming their request for the contribution @ $95,000 and reference the two attachments.  It's likely you will get a denial, but you should copy Freddie Mac on all correspondence with the negotiator.

 

Best of luck,

Thom Colby

Broker

Newport Beach CA  

Permalink Reply by joe beauchamp on August 3, 2011 at 8:26am

You have something funky going on.  I have learned that if you smell something like that, you need to escalate.  If this guy won't give you what you rightly should have, get his ID or name, etc. and let him know that this is important - he is denying a federal program to your client and refusing to document why he is damaging your client's financial future and you cannot allow that to happen without proper documentation, etc.  ESCALATE and don't put up with "I'll ask my nerd-boss to call you." No, he won't call.  The bank is big enough that someone there has the authority to answer you NOW.  Do not let it cool or it will drag out and you'll just give up - which is what they count on.

 

When you get the supervisor, repeat his name, etc. making it clear that you are noting it for any reason like possibly a lawsuit.  If he doesn't care, you probably are not high enough.  If he won't give you what you want, ask for someone with some reasonable authority at the bank who is willing to state their position on the record.  You should eventually get someone with a brain and not just a "how to screw the homeowner" playbook.  Then you have someone to discuss the issues.  You'll get a real answer or you'll find a point to compromise and get to a solution.

 

Good luck - just don't go with"someone will call you back" crap.

Permalink Reply by Jeff Payne on August 3, 2011 at 8:34am

Christy,

You will definately want to make sure you document everything and make sure that you make contact with someone at Freddie Mac.  Wells Fargo emails should have the negotiators manager info on it, do you have the managers info for this negotiator?

I think that you definately need to escalate but would caution to go through the proper channels, give his manager a chance to make it right and if that does not work, blow them both in to senior level VPs.  I would be more than happy to share some good contacts with you if the manager does not want to help.  I can't imagine that they want to drag anything out, the negotiator is either just a jerk or has way too much on his plate, either way Wells needs to make it right for you. My experience has been good with escalations at Wells Fargo

Permalink Reply by joe beauchamp on August 3, 2011 at 8:47am

Jeff, it has been a while for me to be in serious talks with WF - appreciate seeing your input.  Just one semi-minor suggestion - the feel good crap.  Along the way, whoever the jerk is who cannot see the forest for the trees at WF, mention that it isn't him, you appreciate all he is doing, blah, blah, but you need to talk to someone who can make you understand so you can explain to the seller/buyer/whatever.  Honey vs. vinegar approach.  Bank people get plenty of vinegar - and usually deserve at least double, but it puts you down the tube - keep the objection in mind - serve your seller, get the deal down, kowtow to the idiots until you get to someone with a position and a brain and then get the job done.  Yes, painful, but it is the right approach.. (That appears to be our lowly lot in life, eh?)

Jeff Payne said:

Christy,

You will definately want to make sure you document everything and make sure that you make contact with someone at Freddie Mac.  Wells Fargo emails should have the negotiators manager info on it, do you have the managers info for this negotiator?

I think that you definately need to escalate but would caution to go through the proper channels, give his manager a chance to make it right and if that does not work, blow them both in to senior level VPs.  I would be more than happy to share some good contacts with you if the manager does not want to help.  I can't imagine that they want to drag anything out, the negotiator is either just a jerk or has way too much on his plate, either way Wells needs to make it right for you. My experience has been good with escalations at Wells Fargo

Permalink Reply by Jeff Payne on August 3, 2011 at 8:56am

I totally agree with you.  I learned the hard way and Wells legal department called my broker and warned us :).  Since then I have actually changed my approach and treat them all the way that I would treat a buyer or seller or anyone for that matter.  These people don't have easy jobs and most of them don't keep these jobs long, especially if they have agents screaming at them every day.  MOST of the time if they continue to tell you know, it is not their fault, they are just not allowed to say yes. Over the years I have built some great relationships with negotiators and the good ones remember when we treat them well.   Treat them like dogs and they will reciprocate. Treat them well and they will reciprocate. 

I wouldn't want their job. 

joe beauchamp said:

Jeff, it has been a while for me to be in serious talks with WF - appreciate seeing your input.  Just one semi-minor suggestion - the feel good crap.  Along the way, whoever the jerk is who cannot see the forest for the trees at WF, mention that it isn't him, you appreciate all he is doing, blah, blah, but you need to talk to someone who can make you understand so you can explain to the seller/buyer/whatever.  Honey vs. vinegar approach.  Bank people get plenty of vinegar - and usually deserve at least double, but it puts you down the tube - keep the objection in mind - serve your seller, get the deal down, kowtow to the idiots until you get to someone with a position and a brain and then get the job done.  Yes, painful, but it is the right approach.. (That appears to be our lowly lot in life, eh?)

Jeff Payne said:

Christy,

You will definately want to make sure you document everything and make sure that you make contact with someone at Freddie Mac.  Wells Fargo emails should have the negotiators manager info on it, do you have the managers info for this negotiator?

I think that you definately need to escalate but would caution to go through the proper channels, give his manager a chance to make it right and if that does not work, blow them both in to senior level VPs.  I would be more than happy to share some good contacts with you if the manager does not want to help.  I can't imagine that they want to drag anything out, the negotiator is either just a jerk or has way too much on his plate, either way Wells needs to make it right for you. My experience has been good with escalations at Wells Fargo

Permalink Reply by Thom Colby CA Brkr 888-391-5245 on August 3, 2011 at 9:27am

I agree with Jeff.

 

Personally, I have a two-fold approach; 

 

1) I always speak well with the negotiators, etc.  They are people too and deserve to be treated with respect and dignity.  Their job stinks, they listen to agents & brokers screaming at them all day.  Your single rational, pleasant voice might be the one they remember and want to help.  I usually start my conversations with "Hi, this is Thom Colby, I'm a Broker in Southern CA and I need your help" .  Human nature is that we all want to help each other - so likely that person on the othetr end of the line will likely want to help you.  Then I go on with my dilemma or whatever the issue is.

2) If 1 doesn't work or if this is a follow-up and promises have not been kept or the situation is changing on you (in other words, time to get tough) then my conversation typically goes something like this; " Hi, my name is Thom Colby, I'm a Broker in Southern CA.  This is a follow-up call regarding LOAN # 123456 on 123 Main Street in Beverly Hills CA."  (Again go into the details of why you are calling.  If you are getting no-where, or you are getting the runaround, then....)  "And, how do you spell your name? Great, thank you.  This call is being recorded correct?, Great, that's terrific.  Let me just make a note for the recorded call - Currently, the time is 2:20pm Pacific Time on July 4th 2011.  My name is Thom Colby, Broker Southern CA and your name is Joe Smith, a negotiator at Wells Fargo - your telephone number (or ID#, etc.) is XYZ123.  Is this information correct?  Great, thanks so much.  Just for your records, I also record all telephone calls (which I do when they go haywire but not without prior notice).  Then I repeat exactly what they are telling me such as "so Joe, Wells Fargo is requesting $95,000 paid outside of Escrow via a promissory note, is that correct?  And, this property is in California which is subject to SB931 and SB458 which you are aware of, correct?

 

You get the drift - be as nice as can be, repeat their name (nicely) and repeat everything they have requested or stated - make it known (nicely) that you are "on-the-record" and keeping good notes, plus speaking to their recording device.

 

I've only had to do this about 20 times, but it always works - typically, I get a call back from a very senior person within a few hours.  ALWAYS, Be Nice.

 

Good luck,

 

Thom Colby

Broker / Negotiator

Newport Beach CA

Jeff Payne said:

I totally agree with you.  I learned the hard way and Wells legal department called my broker and warned us :).  Since then I have actually changed my approach and treat them all the way that I would treat a buyer or seller or anyone for that matter.  These people don't have easy jobs and most of them don't keep these jobs long, especially if they have agents screaming at them every day.  MOST of the time if they continue to tell you know, it is not their fault, they are just not allowed to say yes. Over the years I have built some great relationships with negotiators and the good ones remember when we treat them well.   Treat them like dogs and they will reciprocate. Treat them well and they will reciprocate. 

I wouldn't want their job. 

joe beauchamp said:

Jeff, it has been a while for me to be in serious talks with WF - appreciate seeing your input.  Just one semi-minor suggestion - the feel good crap.  Along the way, whoever the jerk is who cannot see the forest for the trees at WF, mention that it isn't him, you appreciate all he is doing, blah, blah, but you need to talk to someone who can make you understand so you can explain to the seller/buyer/whatever.  Honey vs. vinegar approach.  Bank people get plenty of vinegar - and usually deserve at least double, but it puts you down the tube - keep the objection in mind - serve your seller, get the deal down, kowtow to the idiots until you get to someone with a position and a brain and then get the job done.  Yes, painful, but it is the right approach.. (That appears to be our lowly lot in life, eh?)

Jeff Payne said:

Christy,

You will definately want to make sure you document everything and make sure that you make contact with someone at Freddie Mac.  Wells Fargo emails should have the negotiators manager info on it, do you have the managers info for this negotiator?

I think that you definately need to escalate but would caution to go through the proper channels, give his manager a chance to make it right and if that does not work, blow them both in to senior level VPs.  I would be more than happy to share some good contacts with you if the manager does not want to help.  I can't imagine that they want to drag anything out, the negotiator is either just a jerk or has way too much on his plate, either way Wells needs to make it right for you. My experience has been good with escalations at Wells Fargo

Permalink Reply by Christy Brock on August 3, 2011 at 11:48am

Thanks everyone for the suggestions.  This afternoon I received a message from the HAFA Escalation Group and they are in contact with Freddie Mac.  I am also going to try to escalate this on the Wells Fargo side.

 

I'll post an update!

Permalink Reply by Christy Brock on August 4, 2011 at 4:46am

Hi Everyone,

 

Good News!  The saga appears to have ended.  This morning I received this message from a different negotiator at Wells Fargo:

 

Good Morning,

   

Congratulations!  The offer submitted for short sale review has been approved.  Attached are the approval letter and closing instructions.  The Closer assigned to the account will contact you within 3 business days.   

  

If you have not heard back from the Closer within 3 business days, please feel to contact me for a status update. 

Please note the attached short sale affidavit must be fully executed for closer to settle file.

 

Permalink Reply by Christy Brock on August 4, 2011 at 12:18pm

I thought I was out of the woods on this one but I was wrong!  Wells Fargo Home Mortgage has approved the short sale but Wells Fargo Home Equity still wants $95,500.  Unbelievable!  The negotiator for the 2nd says the Investor will not put anything in writing until I send a HUD stating the Seller will pay $95,500.  What's worse...the Seller works for Wells Fargo and is being relocated.  This makes absolutely no sense!  Today I sent the negotiator for the 2nd a copy of SB 458 showing that additional payments are against the law. 

 

If anyone has any contacts at WFHE, I would appreciate some help on this one.

 

I will update again after I get a response. 

 

 

Permalink Reply by Thom Colby CA Brkr 888-391-5245 on August 4, 2011 at 12:31pm

Christy -

 

I suggest you send the WF Relocation Letter the borrower received from their employer, WF - to the WFHE negotiator along with a copy of SB458 and highlight this section;

 

(b) A holder of a note shall not require the trustor, mortgagor,

or maker of the note to pay any additional compensation, aside

from the proceeds of the sale, in exchange for the written consent

to the sale.

 

Christy Brock said:

I thought I was out of the woods on this one but I was wrong!  Wells Fargo Home Mortgage has approved the short sale but Wells Fargo Home Equity still wants $95,500.  Unbelievable!  The negotiator for the 2nd says the Investor will not put anything in writing until I send a HUD stating the Seller will pay $95,500.  What's worse...the Seller works for Wells Fargo and is being relocated.  This makes absolutely no sense!  Today I sent the negotiator for the 2nd a copy of SB 458 showing that additional payments are against the law. 

 

If anyone has any contacts at WFHE, I would appreciate some help on this one.

 

I will update again after I get a response. 

 

 

Permalink Reply by Christy Brock on August 4, 2011 at 12:50pm

Thank Thom.  They have everything at this point.  I sent the bill with arrows pointing to the relevant sections today.  Tomorrow I will continue my search for an escalation dept on the Equity side. 

 

The thing that get me is the refusal to respond in writing.  Real Estate is not a hand-shake business.

Permalink Reply by Thom Colby CA Brkr 888-391-5245 on August 4, 2011 at 12:58pm

They'll never put anything in writing especially if they are requesting to do something illegal or against a newly signed "Bill".  See my post above....

 

Best to you !

Christy Brock said:

Thank Thom.  They have everything at this point.  I sent the bill with arrows pointing to the relevant sections today.  Tomorrow I will continue my search for an escalation dept on the Equity side. 

 

The thing that get me is the refusal to respond in writing.  Real Estate is not a hand-shake business.